as i was sitting in a restaurant with my friend briana(ex-jw), we started talking about how we see other ex-jw's inability to let go.
i know many have suffered and endured horrific events or trials as jw's, which i assume it would be hard to let go.
though, do we really have the ability to let go lead a normal life with not thinking twice or having fear in our actions?.
Remember that neuralizer device in the "Men in Black" movie? If a human had a close encounter with an alien, their memory is wiped and replaced with one of those things.
I guess I'd need a healthy dose of neuralizing. Other than that, jw crap is mixed into every memory I have. If I let go of all the jw stuff...there's not much left.
the origins of jehovah is the irish letter jodh, which gave rise to the hebrew yod, the first letter of god's name.
this letter jodh or yodh (the greek iota) is our modern "i" and "j.
" the irish druids associated this letter with the tree we refer to as the yew (from yeu or yodh).
at the service meeting the other day the "friends" were given an opportunity to discuss the district convention (portland, or, june 30-july 2).
) people baptized at that convention.
a bigger number than i remember for at least a decade.
And did this work? It's mainly why I faded, but it didn't work. I was "inactive" and refused to meet with anyone. The assumption was that I was sinning or apostate, neither of which was true.
Yes, it has worked so far. I never refused to meet with anyone. I had very deep connections with everyone. Leaving was as sad for them as it was for me.
I made sure they understood that my "sin" and thus my reason for leaving was doubt. They could not disfellowship me for doubting.
When asked if I thought that Jehovah's Witnesses were God's chosen organization on earth today, I merely said that I had my doubts.
My publisher card was removed from the file and they no longer contact me.
at the service meeting the other day the "friends" were given an opportunity to discuss the district convention (portland, or, june 30-july 2).
) people baptized at that convention.
a bigger number than i remember for at least a decade.
My recent shunning experienced by an old friend and this thread about child baptism got me thinking about the legal binding contract of my baptism. The contract I entered into when I was 9 years old.
I have to admit, that since I am not df'd nor da'd...I still feel tied/chained in some way to the organization. Maybe, I have finally reached a point in my life that psychologically I need to make a decision.
I no longer wish to be a Jehovah's Witness. I have faded successfully (except for the occasional shunning episode). I chose to fade instead of publically renounce my faith in order to leave communication open with my family.
In theory, there are only two ways to leave the organization...get disfellowshipped or disassociate yourself. In my case, the elders chose to leave me alone. I suppose they do not consider me a threat. My publisher card was removed from the congregation's file. I was fine with that.
What that means is no sheparding calls and when the Circuit Overseer visits, the elders don't have to explain my being inactive and what they have/haven't done about it. Plus, it makes the society's overall figures look better to just sweep people like me under the rug.
Back to my baptism. What did I agree to at 9 years old?
Well, since it was before 1985 when the society followed the "new light" and changed the baptismal questions...
I agreed to repent of my sins (which weren't many since I was only 9)
I agreed to recognize myself as a condemned sinner who needs salvation (um ok)
I agreed that salvation came from God through Jesus
I agreed to dedicate myself to God
These are the things that I agreed to when I was baptised.
Well in 1985, it seems the Society changed one little thing:
Children getting baptised were no longer dedicating themselves to God but, to an organization.
You can look this up yourself. I was shocked. This may be old news to you...but, it's the first I really thought about it.
Old questions:
WT May 1, 1973 p. 280
(1) Have you repented of your sins and turned around, recognizing yourself before Jehovah God as a condemned sinner who needs salvation, and have you acknowledged to him that this salvation proceeds from him, the Father, through his Son, Jesus Christ?
(2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation, have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through his son, Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening power of the holy spirit?
New questions:
WT June 1, 1985 p. 30
(1) On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?
(2) Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit directed organization? Having answered yes to these questions, candidates are in a right heart condition to undergo Christian baptism.
It was interesting to read the Society's own words about baptism.
when we dedicate our lives to Jehovah. We do not dedicate ourselves to a religion, nor to a man, nor to an organization. No, we dedicated ourselves to the Supreme Sovereign of the Universe, our Creator, Jehovah God himself. [Oct. 1, 1966 Watchtower, pp. 603-4]
I'm sure this point has been brought up before and doesn't amount to a hill of beans. If I said "hey I didn't dedicate my life to an organization, I dedicated my life to God..."they'd figure out a way around that. They'd say I agreed to serve God by means of the organization and abide by their rules or something.
I just wonder if these children today at 10 & 12 years of age know they are dedicating their lives to a man made organization. I wonder if they know that if they decide later, let's say at 18 or 19 yrs old, they really don't want to be in the jw club anymore... that they will lose their families forever. I wonder if they realize they will be isolated and shunned. That their support network will be lost. That it could cause psychological problems like depression and suicide.
I know that at age 9, I didn't realize these things.
gerrit losch (it's pronounced kinda like "lirsh") did two things at our dc (portland, or june 30-july 2).
he released the new book about the minor prophets, and he gave the closing talk, the one with the resolution in it.
first of all, losch was not promoted to the governing body because of his speaking ability.
.
that is, if you are able to without the prospect of facing a three-man kangaroo court appointed by jerhover to keep the congregation clean from apostate influences.. i'll go first: .
Hey Cal. nice outfit...I particularly like the blue orb on your shroomie friend's sweater.
btw...re. OFG. u best get in line girlfriend. *snaps her finger in a z" lol
...that it hurts the most.
today, when i was walking into the grocery store entrance an old jw friend of mine was walking out.
it was one of those face to face akward moments where there's no way you can pretend the other person isn't there.
What happened to you was upsetting, but don't let them grind you down with their hate. Be proud. The decisions you make for yourself take real courage, a fact dubs are unable to comprehend.
thank you. you're such a sweet little bird.
...that it hurts the most.
today, when i was walking into the grocery store entrance an old jw friend of mine was walking out.
it was one of those face to face akward moments where there's no way you can pretend the other person isn't there.
Hi Ms Whip,I'm surprised that JWs are shunning you if you're not df'd or da'd. Were you ever baptized?
I'm a lifer ms. dipity. baptised before i was 10.
And the worst part will be later on when she tells her friends and family how she stood strong against the evil apostate--how wonderful and faithful she will feel! That's the sickest part of shunning--not just that they strangle whatever loving instincts they may have, but that they actually brag about it later.
yeah, that makes me nauseous. that sister will tell another sister or a few others, they then will make up a story about the situation to make it sound juicier (ie i was wearing thigh high boots & a mini skirt with my boobs hanging out or i was handing out apostate literature at the pic-n-sav) then i'll have to hear it back from my relatives...what did i do to sister so-n-so to make her so upset? i should be more low-key about my apostate self. ugh!
i was wondering how common it is for ex-jws to relocate after leaving the borg in order to escape the bad memories of being in a cult, or to break contact with cult members.. i have wanted to move far away for as long as i can remember--even as a kid--for this purpose.
various life circumstances have delayed that--long story--but mr. rebel8 and i are thinking of moving within the next few years.
i am the one who's most interested in moving to a completely different type of place--different culture, different climate, different everything!
I should have moved right away. Life would have been less stressful.
A drastic move is a lot to take on, especially when you have no support system.
Living in the same town you were a jw in sucks. You can't even hang christmas lights because someone might see you and tell. You have to worry about running into jws everywhere you go.
Plus you have to deal with jw relatives on a weekly basis telling you how close the end is.
Best thing to do is sell most of your stuff you don't need, throw out anything and everything jw... pack the rest up and get outta dodge.
...that it hurts the most.
today, when i was walking into the grocery store entrance an old jw friend of mine was walking out.
it was one of those face to face akward moments where there's no way you can pretend the other person isn't there.
I'm still shaken up over this.
shunning is a devastating practice. You feel like crap.
It feels like they still have control even though I am long gone.
If they could practice stoning, I think they would. Take a young girl out back of the kingdom hall and stone her to death for some trivial sin. There is that much hatred.
Yes, I am not disfellowshipped nor have I disassociated. I've been shunned many times. Usually, it's just a matter of the witness pretending i'm not there or walking to the other part of a store. I've been shunned by people who I didn't want to talk to anyway...so that didn't bother me as much. This is someone I cared for and who I thought cared for me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shunning Shunning is the act of deliberately avoiding association with, and habitually keeping away from an individual or group. It is a sanction against association often associated with religious groups and other tightly-knit organizations and communities. Shunning has a long history as a means of organizational influence and control. Extreme forms of shunning and related practices have rendered the general practice controversial in some circles.Shunning is often used as a pejorative term to describe any organizationally mandated disassociation, and has acquired a connotation of abuse and relational aggression. This is due to the sometimes extreme damage caused by its disruption to normal relationships between individuals, such as friendships and family relations. Disruption of established relationships certainly causes pain, which is at least an unintended consequence of the practices described here, though it may also in many cases be an intended, coercive consequence. This pain, especially when seen as unjustly inflicted, can have secondary general psychological effects on self-worth and self-confidence, trust and trustworthiness, and can, as with other types of trauma, impair psychological function.
Shunning often involves implicit or explicit shame for a member who commits acts seen as wrong by the group or its leadership. Such shame may not be psychologically damaging if the membership is voluntary and the rules of behaviour clear before the person joined. However, if the rules are arbitrary, the group membership seen as essential for personal security, safety, or health, or if the application of the rules are inconsistent, such shame can be highly destructive. This can be especially damaging if perceptions are attacked or controlled, or various tools of psychological pressure applied. Extremes of this cross over the line into psychological torture and can be permanently scarring.
A key detrimental effect of some of the practices associated with shunning relate to their effect on relationships, especially family relationships. At its extremes, the practices may destroy marriages, break up families, and separate children and their parents. The effect of shunning can be very dramatic or even devastating on the shunnee, as it can damage or destroy the shunned member's closest familial, spousal, social, emotional, and economic bonds.
Shunning contains aspects of what is known as relational aggression in psychological literature. When used by church members and member-spouse parents against excommunicant parents it contains elements of what pyschologists call parental alienation. Extreme shunning may cause traumas to the shunned (and to their dependents) similar to what is studied in the psychology of torture.
